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Overheard on the Island.
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Apr 11 2007, 8:28 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Apr 11 2007, 6:04 PM EDT
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I was just about to make an Overheard:Vancouver Island site. But I thought I'd google to see if anyone had started one on the Island already. Seems like you have. I don't want to step on your toes or anything, so I was wondering if you wanted to combine forces? I only have a few entries to start off with, but some of them are from Victoria, some from Nanaimo (where I'm from) and some are from Parksville, so I wanted to just do a site for the whole Island. Please Email me celenaszoo at hotmail dot com.
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RE: Overheard on the Island.
By: Yule,
Apr 11 2007, 8:28 PM EDT
This site is pretty deeply in hibernation, so you won't be stepping on anyone's toes here...! The conversation has moved robustly & with a great deal of animation to the forum on Vibrant Victoria, so check that out if you're interested. There's no "overheard" thread, but lots of good stuff to read. (see http://vibrantvictoria.ca/forum/)
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problem commenting on yr blog
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Feb 3 2007, 5:11 AM EST by
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Thread started: Feb 3 2007, 5:11 AM EST
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Hi Yule, I tried to leave the following comment on your blog, but I get a message saying I have to be logged in. Then there isn't a way to log in. I realize this is not the right place to leave it - so do delete.
Re Yahoo/Flickr. I think this is a more general problem. I have a problem with the telephone company or my bank, for example, who keep changing the TOS and I don't spend time reading the fine print in all the junkmail I receive. So one day I discover I'm getting no interest from an account that used to be interest bearing! Companies on the web collect information and hide their decision to spread it around under a link that you neglected to follow. Basically, we only have one choice - consume the product or not - all the other choices, about terms etc., belong to them.
melanie
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SRVI
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Jan 26 2007, 1:36 AM EST by
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Thread started: Jan 25 2007, 11:32 PM EST
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Why can't B.C. Gov. put some pressure on C.N. to grant right of way use to E&N ?
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RE: SRVI
By: ,
Jan 26 2007, 1:36 AM EST
I don't know. I wonder whether it has something to do with what strikes me as an arm's-length policy toward cities on the part of provincial & federal governments? The Tyee had an article (and yikes, do read the long string of comments), "For Tories, Cities Aren't Sexy" (published today, 1/25/07), see: http://www1.thetyee.ca/News/2007/01/25/Cities/.
Things like LRT and infrastructural improvements aren't getting done anywhere in Canada, according to a report detailed by this article. (The report, by a committee chaired by Mike Harcourt, is here: http://www.infrastructure.gc.ca/eaccc-ccevc/rep-rap/index_e.shtml . Mike Harcourt's participation in turn elicited some of the fireworks in the comments in the Tyee article.)
On the Vibrant Victoria forum (see http://vibrantvictoria.ca/forum/ ) there's a lively discussion in the "infrastructure" thread around LRT and public transport and where to put it, with all sorts of pro- and con- arguments around whether it should be in the core, or in the so-called Western Communities, or whether it should be buses or LRT or what...
My own take? I feel strongly that LRT has the best chance of succeeding economically, and I say this based on nothing more concrete than a vague psychological intution. And it's this: many people don't like taking the bus, because (IMO) buses are on roads, on which (theoretically) you can go anywhere, & you can see the driver, which means quite clearly that someone else is in the driver's seat. On LRT, there might be a visible driver, but s/he is on a track & has no "choice" about where to go. This somehow mitigates against the passenger's sense of impotence, making him/her more willing to accept being carted about. Buses remind people of cars, but they also remind them that buses are everything that cars are NOT. Trains (esp'y LRT) don't, & they get used more. So, don't put more buses in, put LRT in. That's my 2-cents. It doesn't answer your question, but it's another pitch for LRT.
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West End Vancouver density
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Oct 11 2006, 11:38 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Sep 18 2006, 8:17 PM EDT
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Councillor Pam Madoff claims density in the West End actually decreased when single family homes replaced by highrises in the 1960s due to the large grassy setbacks. I would like to see the stats that back up this remarkable claim.
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RE: West End Vancouver density
By: ,
Oct 11 2006, 11:38 PM EDT
Sorry, I wasn't signed in before: that comment above is from me (Yule).
I want to add something, though: you write "James Bay is the place council put buildings they don't know where else to put." What exactly do you think "council" is -- an omnipotent force or something? A "they"? Do you really think "council" is orchestrating development with some sort of unseen hand?
Look, no one is sitting around council table saying, "ok guys, let's spare Rockland and dump this next condo in James Bay." It doesn't work that way. Council is reactive, and you're reacting to the reaction. Great.
Nor is it the case that there's this evil cabal of developers sitting around in some backroom smoking cigars, saying, "ok guys, lets rodger JB till it bleeds."
You write, "James Bay needs help quickly." By whose lights? According to whose criteria? A friend of mine (Victoria native) moved out of JB because it was too parochial -- don't assume that you speak for everyone when you say "we want to keep it the way it was before it was," because chances are you're just representing one minority view.
Also, the idea that "James Bay needs help" is insulting. Help from whom? If the people who actually live there aren't on the barricades making a difference, maybe it's the case that your view is a minority view. Maybe you shouldn't be living in JB. Cities change. It might be sad, but consider the alternative: a place like the village of Portmeirion in North Wales, where the 60s cult classic "The Prisoner" was filmed, maybe? Believe it or not, I have friends from high school (Oak Bay High) who consider OB a PERFECT setting for the prisoner, which is why they left. Who needs to be a prisoner -- who wants to be a prisoner? Cities are made up of many different kinds of people, including non-prisoners, including people who won't agree with your point of view.
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The falls
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Sep 16 2006, 1:15 AM EDT by
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Thread started: Sep 15 2006, 4:17 PM EDT
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The Falls looks neat but is it really going to be creamy orange in color?
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RE: The falls
By: ,
Sep 16 2006, 1:15 AM EDT
There is one additional fuzzy-wuzzy "rendering" on the official website (http://www.thefallsvictoria.com), by which I mean that it is even less clear regarding the exterior finish (because it's "impressionistically" rendered), and the short answer to your question is, "I don't know." I doubt however that the orange will be as saturated a hue as the rendering suggests, even if (when?) the concrete is painted.
Oh well, I have heard that orange is the favourite colour of insane people, and maybe the building's colour will be a testament to how the permitting process in Victoria drove the developer crazy... <jk>
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Langham Court
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Sep 11 2006, 2:27 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Sep 9 2006, 9:13 PM EDT
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Great article. I saw "Visiting Mr. Green" there a couple of years ago. Nice to know the renovations will ensure the viability of the theatre long into the future. It seems such a beloved and accepted part of the neighbourhood but I can imagine the uproar if it had never existed but was proposed today. The area residents would be up in arms. "A theatre! In our residential neighbourhood! Think of the parking! The crowds! The noise! The kittens! Nevah!!!"
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RE: East Cultural District
By: ,
Sep 11 2006, 2:27 PM EDT
The Truth Centre currently houses Ballet Victoria as a tenant. BV (essentially powered by the husband and wife team of Jacqueline Sloan & Colin Doroschuk -- the latter of "Men Without Hats" fame) in turn also offers ballet classes, and of course the rehearsals for its productions are held there. Other than that, however, the Truth Ctr. is pretty stable and not likely to morph into a performing arts centre... Although the possibility has a certain "wow!" factor, that's for sure...
I had an idea earlier this summer that the extensive grounds of the Truth Ctr would be an ideal location for a biweekly weekends open air arts market and antiquarian bookfair... You know, the local galleries and the local independent/ unaffiliated artists, together with booksellers, could offer a kind of "Parisian" market experience... It would be a sort of "arts tourism" type thing for the summer (and into fall?), too, what with tourists straying up Fort Street anyway to get to Craigdarroch Castle, which of course is also on the way/ in that quadrant. It would really enliven Fort St., what with the Kilshaw's less than 100m to the south, the antique store across the street (about halfway between Kilshaw's and the Truth Ctr.).
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Fountain of Youth
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Sep 11 2006, 11:09 AM EDT by
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Thread started: Sep 10 2006, 5:05 PM EDT
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This would be the fountain that the "Friends of Beacon Hill Park" deem not sober enough for the Little Lord Fauntleroys and Fauntlerettes they envision will be the end users.
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RE: Fountain of Youth
By: ,
Sep 11 2006, 11:09 AM EDT
It hasn't been a stellar year for Canada at Venice lately in my opinion. I haven't seen the sweater but I did see B.C. artist Rebecca Belmore's underwhelming installation representing Canada at the Venice Art Biennale last summer.
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Addendum added
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Sep 7 2006, 1:59 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Sep 7 2006, 1:59 PM EDT
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You're right, Stuart, that a fixed link would have been an impossibility "back then," and it's still practically impossible now. (See the "comments" conversation, above, in "comprehensive planning, planned ambitions...") So I wrote something up about how the internet might/ could be our virtual bridge to anywhere, in an addendum posted as a "subpage" to this essay...
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comprehensive planning, planned ambitions: life happens
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Sep 6 2006, 2:13 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Aug 29 2006, 10:29 PM EDT
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I want to comment / add more later, but for the meantime -- the Permanent Loan Bldg & the Campbell Bldg were destroyed during a period of ambitious, centrally planned urban thinking (is that even the right word?, thinking?; I guess it is...), which really reinforces, for me, the idea that centralised planning is NOT a good idea. We have councillors at City Hall and we have people in the neighbourhoods who want Centralised Planning Now, who want a Comprehensive Downtown Plan, and who want the Planning Dept to say with certainty what the boundaries of downtown will look like, along with the things within downtown. It's not the case that these people are evil or benighted, they just want rules, and accountability. But I can't help thinking that they're looking for them in the wrong place. "Do A., and B. will happen." Nuh-uh. It just doesn't work that way, not in a living city. Centralised planning and comprehensive plans/ rules choke the living life out of a place: they don't respect the spirit of the place.
Which is not to say that developers (who don't necessarily respect any plans/ rules) have the "spirit" of a place close to their hearts, because, let's face it, they have to check in with their wallets (kept in a back pocket, hence the expression "greedy-ass developer"... <joke>).
About Victoria's history: Confederation and the completion of the trans-Canada railway did the most to herald the deathknell for a vibrant Victoria, IMO. Once Vancouver had that bloody terminal, ALL the go-getters who knew a thing or two about the blood-sweat-and-tears necessary to building an economy got up and left Victoria. Just take a look at the history of the Chinese and the Jewish communities in Victoria for proof. The Leiser Warehouse (part of the lower Yates redevelopment) and the Leiser family are a case in point, as is the fact that Vic's Chinatown WAS the biggest/ oldest for a while, but was overtaken by Vancouver.
My money's on the internet: no RR needed now?
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Metropolitan Ambitions
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Aug 29 2006, 9:49 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Aug 29 2006, 9:49 PM EDT
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Old Victoria's "metropolitan ambitions" were clearly evident in the BC Permanent Loan Building and the Campbell Building. The former stood at Johnson and Douglas, the latter at Fort and Douglas. I almost feel like crying whenever I come across a picture of either of these buildings.
Is it a coincidence that both of them were destroyed during the heyday of the tourism-oriented "olde England" revisionism of the 1960s and 1970s?
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"nesting" structure of this wiki format
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Aug 27 2006, 11:26 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Aug 27 2006, 11:26 PM EDT
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I posted a reply to anonymous's comment, but it's nested under his (?) comment, and it takes some clicking to find it. Best way is to click on anonymous's header, "community consultation," which brings up his comment and my reply.
This is not an intuitve or user-friendly way of structuring the information, I must say....
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community consultation
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Aug 27 2006, 7:39 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Aug 26 2006, 7:06 PM EDT
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My initial thought is how this reminds me of the Castana/Food County debaucle in that the final result is likely much worse than if all sides stepped away from the table for a moment to sincerely consider what would be the best architectural solution for the site.
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RE: community consultation
By: ,
Aug 27 2006, 7:39 PM EDT
There is some similarity with Castana/ Food Country insofar as developer and community have been at loggerheads since Day One. It's different, though, insofar as 1322 is tucked away in a residential spot and has no commercial component, unlike Castana, which is on a main street and includes residential and commercial.
I can't begin to speculate on financial similarities. All I know is that the current owner's original proposal would vault this (the 1322) development into the many-multi-million-dollar range (she bought the property for just under $2m [I think], and an earlier scaled-down proposal included 22 condos [average price?, maybe $400-500K?], 6 THs [average price?, at least $750K if not more], and the coachhouse [add another TH price at least], and... well, YOU do the math -- it's a ton of money, that's for sure...). Naturally, the $-amounts involved merely exacerbated hostilities and upped the ante all around.
What I find very interesting is that Rockland is ~70% renters -- i.e., it's a nice little fairy-tale to think of it as an enclave of SFH, but in reality it isn't. I'm not sure how Fairfield (the neighbourhood with Castana/ Food Country) adds up. But it is the case that the Rockland Neighbourhood Association has less than 10% of the Rockland population as members, and that its board is almost always exclusively composed of property owners, i.e., primarily people who own a SFH in Rockland, or even a MFH. The renters aren't represented, and don't seem to be interested in joining these boards, either (currently, one renter is on the board, but he has political ambitions [IMO] that go way beyond Rockland).
The fights take place between yesteryear's small-scale property owners and newer, big-scale property owners (the developers), with the renters staying out of it for the most part. That's too bad, I think. Since they make up the majority of the population, it would be interesting to know where they stand on development...
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KeyPlanet
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Aug 4 2006, 11:21 AM EDT by
Anonymous |
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Thread started: Jul 23 2006, 1:54 AM EDT
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On discovery of this Cliff Hypothesis (and I found it here, for which I am grateful), I've acquired it and knee deep in the first several chapters, hopefully to discover the primordial reason I'm in the highest building on Rockland, and Victoria. I don't think I can come down into the trees. I have cracked Da Valley Code.
Victoria is coined a Garden City - citta giardino - obviously because almost half the year is spring-like weather; cool and showery. Great for botany, but fatal to evening sidewalk culture. However, in many areas that were cleared at the turn of the last century, it is now returned to a Forest City, with much help from decades of environmental awareness. I look down on a Rockland submerged under 5 to 7 storey trees. I have guests thinking I live next to a park! Many homes in Uplands enjoy neither a sunrise nor set.
My last residence was clinging on the lower slopes of Gonzales Hill. But wherever I abode, I must have a view to the southwest. A view of the sky. Realtors can't fathom the request. Mountin view? Ocean view? No, a blue view. It's a grey winter here and you need to catch the few rays are thrown in the dark months during the cool monsoon.
I need to see the southwest because that's where are prevailing winds come from, that's where the weather comes from, that's where you can literally, see the future.
Skill-testing question; in which direction does the camera pan in cinema to seque to the future?
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RE: KeyPlanet
By: Posted Anonymously,
Aug 4 2006, 11:21 AM EDT
"Oh, ps: what I also wanted to add to this mix is the concept of "attention" (as addressed in the "Linkiography" section by the link to environmental psychology, which highlights _attention_ as a factor). In particular, take a look however at this paper:
http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/468828.html
by Richard A. Lanham, called "The Economics of Attention: Style and Substance in the Age of Information." I won't claim to have digested this in its entirety myself, but I think it's symptomatic of something larger happening in an information-saturated culture (d'oh! -- how's that for a "gloss"?).
Scrambling to define _and_ capture attention is happening in business, that's certain. In that regard, see also Dave Pollard's "How to Save the World" blog, specifically his entries on "Customer Anthropology":
http://blogs.salon.com/0002007/2006/06/21.html
also perhaps:
http://blogs.salon.com/0002007/2005/11/11.html
and maybe:
http://blogs.salon.com/0002007/2006/05/01.html
" Mea culpa my tardiness, thank you so much for the links, I'll get to them when I have a moment.
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KeyPlanet
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Jul 21 2006, 11:29 AM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 21 2006, 12:15 AM EDT
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Victoria is a Terminal City, in more ways than one. It used to represent the brief end of one's life - retirement and death - and still does, but now, people have an extended semi-retirement (at socially acceptable earlier ages) and, lingering seniorhood, well subsidized.
But it also The End for many other aspirations and endevours, especially in the arts, acutely because of the perpetual small population.
It's the end of style, of grace, of form, including bodily form. Think of a body type and universal "dress code" for the City. I apologize for causing that thought. Is there ever a place where the rule of grump and frump still reigns.
Even provincial governments are borne and formed elsewhere in the ridings of the province, but die here in the Legislature.
Career professionals find themselves lying in the Velvet Rut, that soft swale in the their local lawns that prevents them from getting up and re-establishing - even a few kms to Vancouver - to successfully ply their talents. They're half-way into a grave.
Many in the City live on inheritances, the repitive legacy of terminality.
Don't dare begin to skip travel to other urbs, because the that terminal grip pulls you like a bony hand. And you find yourself not leaving for an entire year.
If it weren't for the gardens, the little City would've turned into a suicide capital like Venezia. In Victoria, it's the end, but a pleasant one. Spring is five months long, and winters are cool monsoons. It's a soft landing, the end, real soft. But it is, terminal.
Terminal City.
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RE: KeyPlanet
By: ,
Jul 21 2006, 11:29 AM EDT
This a great and poetic (if somewhat depressing!) observation, KeyPlanet... Certainly when I and my other high school friends were at Vic High & OB High in the 70s, we couldn't wait to get away because options seemed to end here, while they seemed to begin elsewhere.
So, have I come back here to die, or (worse?) to grow soft? What an uncomfortable thought! Granted, those who "got away" and stayed that way still regard Victoria as a place for "losers," and Victoria continues to suffer from this schizophrenic attitude that on the one hand one is "better" or superior simply by dint of having made it all the way to here (notice how even newcomers often enough adopt this mantle of fabricated "uniqueness" and "Englishness"), while at the same time one must be a "loser" because one didn't manage to get out or stay away (the old "Victoria is only for retirees" story, so unless you're a rich retiree, you must be a real lost cause...)
But (and maybe I'm deluded), I like to think that we're potentially on the cutting edge of something new insofar as the internet is a sort of End of Ends: it reaches into even this "garden," this final (ends, again) colonial outpost of former (ended) empire, bringing new beginnings for conversation, polity, and (gasp!) economic activity. Perhaps those new beginnings will also all end in the same place (we all gotta die eventually), but perhaps Terminal City will grow fibreoptic connections that link us to the rest of the world after all, and show even the craniosclerotic (is that a word?) that the world doesn't end where you are. Let's say it's just beginning...? ;-)
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Right on! Human scale - not human sized
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Jul 20 2006, 2:08 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 20 2006, 2:08 PM EDT
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I brilliant blurb on the so often abused idea of human scale. It so true that when we are walking down the street we are not considering how tall the building above us but rather what an interesting bike or shirt that is in the window. Keep up the great work here!
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melanie |
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cars and the built environment
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Jul 19 2006, 6:35 AM EDT by
melanie |
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Thread started: Jul 17 2006, 10:53 PM EDT
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I look forward to your essay on the growth of suburbia which, while dependent on cars, could result from either an attempt to escape from a city destroyed by cars or an attempt to escape from (urban?) society for other reasons.
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Last Reply:
RE: cars and the built environment
By: melanie,
Jul 19 2006, 6:35 AM EDT
"Oh, Melanie! You have too much confidence in me! Kidding aside, though, thanks for stopping in and leaving a comment. As for whether I'll ever write anything about suburbia, which gives me the hives, ...I don't know.
But maybe this, for now: I just listened to a couple of really interesting talks on TedBlog (see http://tedblog.typepad.com/tedblog/2006/06/sir_ken_robinso.html for example), including David Pogue (and Majora Carter, about whom I added a little entry under the "Greens promote 'denser' communities..." -- she's fantastic), and this leads me to the following snippy observation (inspired perhaps by Mr.Pogue): the city can be like a good Apple product (and I say this despite the fact that I'm mad at Apple because their product broke on me), but suburbia is definitely MS Windows all the way... Clunky, overburdened, over-tapped, badly designed. And, just like Windows, with 95% of the market share, grrr!" I'll download it at work. I'm still on dialup at home - not only due to my own incompetence. Suburbia has changed too I think - especially with the advent of standardized designs and smaller blocks of land. There's a great Australian movie called <i>The Castle</i> on the subject.
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Great Site.
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Jul 17 2006, 2:33 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 17 2006, 3:31 AM EDT
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I just wanted to Compliment you on your website. It is residence like yourself that will make this city a better place. Cheers on a great job.
Another interesting site for other people to look at is Therealvictoira.ca
Bob Beaumont
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RE: Great Site.
By: ,
Jul 17 2006, 2:33 PM EDT
Thanks for stopping by, Bob, and check back often...! I'm afraid I can't edit your comment to fix the link to therealvictoria.ca, but I see that you probably did that in the follow-up comment. Also, there is a live link for it on the "Some interesting and useful links" page (see Navigation sidebar, on left).
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Human Scale in Vancouver
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Jul 17 2006, 2:29 PM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 17 2006, 2:14 AM EDT
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Skyscraper Page forumer KeyPlan passes along this essay from the Journal of Urban Design: Street-facing Dwelling Units and Livability: The Impacts of Emerging Building Types in Vancouver's High-Density Neighbourhoods (.pdf) http://www-iurd.ced.berkeley.edu/pub/RP-2005-02.pdf
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Last Reply:
RE: Human Scale in Vancouver
By: ,
Jul 17 2006, 2:29 PM EDT
Yes, it's a very interesting analysis by Elizabeth MacDonald. I plan to add a bibliography page soon and include this as a link. I have a couple of annotations for it, too: it did strike me that it focusses on non-mixed use condominiums, which emphasise "front door" townhouses & residential at street level, and the impact this form has in terms of on "eyes on the street" and livability, as per Jane Jacobs. Here in Victoria, two things are different, perhaps: I don't think we'll have the kind of residential concentration Vancouver neighbourhoods analysed by MacDonald have for quite some time, and most of what's getting built here is infill in the downtown core. I.e., it usually includes some retail component at street level, it's often on a commercial street (unlike False Creek, Arbutus Heights, etc.). But there're definitely plenty of useful observations in MacDonald's paper, applicable (in a smaller scale) to here...
One thing that did strike me as hilarious: I have a friend who jokes (acidly) that Victoria has a "Ministry of Perpetual Gardening." It did occur to me that the townhouse residents described by MacDonald must all be official bureaucrats of said ministry... ;-)
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Great essay.
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Jul 16 2006, 2:27 AM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 16 2006, 2:27 AM EDT
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"Density does not necessarily mean highrises" were Harris' words. A gust of wind was created by the flurry of furious head-nodding and delerious note taking amongst the audience. I dread knowing how this comment will be taken out of context and repeated ad nauseum at every future Council meeting involving a tower over six storeys. Ben Lee clarified for me later about the importance of clustering highrises.
I doubt any of those tiresome Parsiophiles have been more than three blocks away from the Champs-Elysees.
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This is great!
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Jul 7 2006, 12:23 AM EDT by
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Thread started: Jul 6 2006, 12:30 PM EDT
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I really love Victoria and this project sounds interesting!
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RE: This is great!
By: ,
Jul 7 2006, 12:23 AM EDT
Hi Ben, thanks for stopping by! This "project" definitely needs a lot more build-out, but I think it's going to be one of those "easy does it" things, sort of like "slow food" or something... ;-) So please stop by again, and if you visit Victoria and have some observations, post away!
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